Pāthikasutta

dn24:2.1.1 Then, Bhaggava, a certain Licchavi minister stood up and said to the assembly,

dn24:2.1.2 ‘Well then, worthies, wait a while, I’ll go.

dn24:2.1.3 Hopefully I’ll be able to lead Pāṭikaputta back to the assembly.’

dn24:2.1.4 So that minister went to see Pāṭikaputta and said,

dn24:2.1.5 ‘Come forth, Reverend Pāṭikaputta! It’s best for you to come forth. All these very well-known people have come forth, and the ascetic Gotama is sitting in your monastery for the day’s meditation.

dn24:2.1.6 You said you’d meet the ascetic Gotama half-way.

dn24:2.1.10 The ascetic Gotama has come the first half, and is sitting in your monastery.

dn24:2.1.11 The ascetic Gotama has told the assembly

dn24:2.1.12 that you’re not capable of meeting him face to face.

dn24:2.1.15 Come forth, Pāṭikaputta! When you come forth we’ll make you win and the ascetic Gotama lose.’

dn24:2.2.1 When he had spoken, Pāṭikaputta said: ‘I’m coming, respectable sir, I’m coming!’ But wriggle as he might, he couldn’t get up from his seat.

dn24:2.2.2 Then the minister said to Pāṭikaputta,

dn24:2.2.3 ‘What’s up, Reverend Pāṭikaputta? Is your bottom stuck to the bench, or is the bench stuck to your bottom?

dn24:2.2.4 You say “I’m coming, respectable sir, I’m coming!” But wriggle as you might, you can’t get up from your seat.’

dn24:2.2.5 And as he was speaking, Pāṭikaputta said: ‘I’m coming, respectable sir, I’m coming!’ But wriggle as he might, he couldn’t get up from his seat.

dn24:2.3.1 When the Licchavi minister knew

dn24:2.3.2 that Pāṭikaputta had lost,

dn24:2.3.3 he returned to the assembly and said,

dn24:2.3.4 ‘Pāṭikaputta has lost, worthies.’

dn24:2.3.5 When he said this, I said to the assembly,

dn24:2.3.6 ‘Pāṭikaputta is not capable of meeting me face to face, otherwise

dn24:2.3.8 his head may explode.

dn24:2.3.9 Even if the good Licchavis were to think,

dn24:2.3.10 “Let’s bind Pāṭikaputta with straps and drag him with a pair of oxen!” But either the straps will break or Pāṭikaputta will.’

dn24:2.4.1 Then, Bhaggava, Jāliya, the pupil of the wood-bowl ascetic, stood up and said to the assembly,

dn24:2.4.2 ‘Well then, worthies, wait a while, I’ll go.

dn24:2.4.3 Hopefully I’ll be able to lead Pāṭikaputta back to the assembly.’

dn24:2.4.4 So Jāliya went to see Pāṭikaputta and said,

dn24:2.4.5 ‘Come forth, Reverend Pāṭikaputta! It’s best for you to come forth. All these very well-known people have come forth, and the ascetic Gotama is sitting in your monastery for the day’s meditation.

dn24:2.4.6 You said you’d meet the ascetic Gotama half-way.

dn24:2.4.10 The ascetic Gotama has come the first half, and is sitting in your monastery.

dn24:2.4.11 The ascetic Gotama has told the assembly

dn24:2.4.12 that you’re not capable of meeting him face to face.

dn24:2.4.15 And he said that even if the Licchavis

dn24:2.4.16 try to bind you with straps and drag you with a pair of oxen, either the straps will break or you will.

dn24:2.4.20 Come forth, Pāṭikaputta! When you come forth we’ll make you win and the ascetic Gotama lose.’

dn24:2.5.1 When he had spoken, Pāṭikaputta said: ‘I’m coming, respectable sir, I’m coming!’ But wriggle as he might, he couldn’t get up from his seat.

dn24:2.5.2 Then Jāliya said to Pāṭikaputta,

dn24:2.5.3 ‘What’s up, Reverend Pāṭikaputta? Is your bottom stuck to the bench, or is the bench stuck to your bottom?

dn24:2.5.4 You say “I’m coming, respectable sir, I’m coming!” But wriggle as you might, you can’t get up from your seat.’

dn24:2.5.5 And as he was speaking, Pāṭikaputta said: ‘I’m coming, respectable sir, I’m coming!’ But wriggle as he might, he couldn’t get up from his seat.

dn24:2.6.1 When Jāliya knew

dn24:2.6.2 that Pāṭikaputta had lost, he said to him,

dn24:2.6.3 ‘Once upon a time, Reverend Pāṭikaputta, it occurred to a lion, king of beasts,

dn24:2.6.4 “Why don’t I make my lair near a certain forest?

dn24:2.6.5 Towards evening I can emerge from my den, yawn, survey the four quarters, roar my lion’s roar three times, and set out on the hunt.

dn24:2.6.6 Having slain the very best of the deer herd, and eaten the most tender flesh, I could return to my den.”

dn24:2.6.7 And so that’s what he did.

dn24:2.6.10 Now, there was an old jackal who had grown fat on the lion’s leavings, becoming arrogant and strong.

dn24:2.6.11 He thought:

dn24:2.6.12 “What does the lion, king of beasts, have that I don’t?

dn24:2.6.13 Why don’t I also make my lair near a certain forest?

dn24:2.6.14 Towards evening I can emerge from my den, yawn, survey the four quarters, roar my lion’s roar three times, and set out on the hunt.

dn24:2.6.15 Having slain the very best of the deer herd, and eaten the most tender flesh, I could return to my den.”

dn24:2.7.1 And so that’s what he did.

dn24:2.7.2 But when he tried to roar a lion’s roar, he only managed to squeal and yelp like a jackal. And what is a pathetic jackal’s squeal next to the roar of a lion?

dn24:2.7.3 In the same way, reverend, while living off the leavings of the Holy One, enjoying the leftovers of the Holy One, you presume to attack the Realized One, the perfected one, the fully awakened Buddha!

dn24:2.7.4 Who are the pathetic Pāṭikaputtas to attack the Realized Ones, the perfected ones, the fully awakened Buddhas?’

dn24:2.8.1 When Jāliya couldn’t get Pāṭikaputta to shift from his seat even with this simile,

dn24:2.8.2 he said to him:

dn24:2.8.3 ‘Seeing himself as equal to the lion,

dn24:2.8.4 the jackal presumed “I’m the king of the beasts!”

dn24:2.8.5 But he actually only managed to yelp,

dn24:2.8.6 and what’s a sad jackal’s squeal to the roar of a lion?

dn24:2.8.7 In the same way, reverend, while living off the leavings of the Holy One, you presume to attack him!’

dn24:2.9.1 When Jāliya couldn’t get Pāṭikaputta to shift from his seat even with this simile,

dn24:2.9.2 he said to him:

dn24:2.9.3 ‘Following in the steps of another,

dn24:2.9.4 seeing himself grown fat on scraps,

dn24:2.9.5 until he doesn’t even see himself,

dn24:2.9.6 the jackal presumes he’s a tiger.

dn24:2.9.7 But he actually only managed to yelp,

dn24:2.9.8 and what’s a sad jackal’s squeal to the roar of a lion?

dn24:2.9.9 In the same way, reverend, while living off the leavings of the Holy One, you presume to attack him!’

dn24:2.10.1 When Jāliya couldn’t get Pāṭikaputta to shift from his seat even with this simile,

dn24:2.10.2 he said to him:

dn24:2.10.3 ‘Gorged on frogs, and mice from the barn,

dn24:2.10.4 and carcasses tossed in the cemetery,

dn24:2.10.5 thriving in the great, empty wood,

dn24:2.10.6 the jackal presumed “I’m the king of the beasts!”

dn24:2.10.7 But he actually only managed to yelp,

dn24:2.10.8 and what’s a sad jackal’s squeal to the roar of a lion?

dn24:2.10.9 In the same way, reverend, while living off the leavings of the Holy One, enjoying the leftovers of the Holy One, you presume to attack the Realized One, the perfected one, the fully awakened Buddha!

dn24:2.10.10 Who are the pathetic Pāṭikaputtas to attack the Realized Ones, the perfected ones, the fully awakened Buddhas?’

dn24:2.11.1 When Jāliya couldn’t get Pāṭikaputta to shift from his seat even with this simile,

dn24:2.11.2 he returned to the assembly and said,

dn24:2.11.3 ‘Pāṭikaputta has lost, worthies. He says “I’m coming, respectable sirs, I’m coming!” But wriggle as he might, he can’t get up from his seat.’

dn24:2.12.1 When he said this, I said to the assembly,

dn24:2.12.2 ‘The naked ascetic Pāṭikaputta is not capable of meeting me face to face, unless he gives up that statement and that intention, and lets go of that view.

dn24:2.12.3 If he thinks he can

dn24:2.12.4 meet me face to face without giving up those things, his head may explode.

dn24:2.12.5 The good Licchavis might even think,

dn24:2.12.6 “Let’s bind Pāṭikaputta with straps and drag him with a pair of oxen!” But either the straps will break or Pāṭikaputta will.

dn24:2.12.7 Pāṭikaputta is not capable of meeting me face to face, otherwise

dn24:2.12.8 his head may explode.’

dn24:2.13.1 Then, Bhaggava, I educated, encouraged, fired up, and inspired that assembly with a Dhamma talk. I released that assembly from the great bondage, and lifted 84,000 beings from the great swamp. Next I entered upon the fire element, rose into the air to the height of seven palm trees, and created a flame another seven palm trees high, blazing and smoking. Finally I landed at the Great Wood, in the hall with the peaked roof.

dn24:2.13.2 Then Sunakkhatta came to me, bowed, and sat down to one side. I said to him,

dn24:2.13.3 ‘What do you think, Sunakkhatta?

dn24:2.13.4 Did the declaration I made about Pāṭikaputta turn out to be correct, or not?’

dn24:2.13.5 ‘It turned out to be correct.’

dn24:2.13.6 ‘What do you think, Sunakkhatta?

dn24:2.13.7 If that is so, has a superhuman demonstration of psychic power been performed or not?’

dn24:2.13.8 ‘Clearly, sir, a superhuman demonstration of psychic power has been performed.’

dn24:2.13.9 ‘Though I perform such a superhuman demonstration of psychic power you say this:

dn24:2.13.10 “But sir, the Buddha never performs any superhuman demonstrations of psychic power for me.”

dn24:2.13.11 See how far you have strayed!’

dn24:2.13.12 Though I spoke to Sunakkhatta like this, he still left this teaching and training, like someone on the highway to hell.

dn24:2.14.0 6. On Describing the Origin of the World

dn24:2.14.1 Bhaggava, I understand the origin of the world.

dn24:2.14.2 I understand this, and what goes beyond it. Yet since I do not misapprehend that understanding, I have realized quenching within myself. Directly knowing this, the Realized One does not come to ruin.

dn24:2.14.3 There are some ascetics and brahmins who describe the origin of the world in their denomination as created by the God Almighty, by the Divinity.

dn24:2.14.4 I go up to them and say,

dn24:2.14.5 ‘Is it really true that this is the venerables’ view?’

dn24:2.14.6 And they answer, ‘Yes’.

dn24:2.14.7 I say to them,

dn24:2.14.8 ‘But how do you describe in your denomination that the origin of the world came about as created by the God Almighty, by the Divinity?’

dn24:2.14.9 But they are stumped by my question, and they even question me in return.

dn24:2.14.10 So I answer them,

dn24:2.14.11 ‘There comes a time when, reverends, after a very long period has passed, this cosmos contracts.

dn24:2.14.12 As the cosmos contracts, sentient beings are mostly headed for the realm of sublime luminosity.

dn24:2.14.13 There they are mind-made, feeding on rapture, self-radiant, wandering in midair, steadily glorious, and they remain like that for a very long time.

dn24:2.15.1 There comes a time when, after a very long period has passed, this cosmos expands.

dn24:2.15.2 As it expands an empty mansion of divinity appears.

dn24:2.15.3 Then a certain sentient being—due to the running out of their life-span or merit—passes away from that host of luminous deities and is reborn in that empty mansion of divinity.

dn24:2.15.4 There they are mind-made, feeding on rapture, self-radiant, wandering in midair, steadily glorious, and they remain like that for a very long time.

dn24:2.16.1 But after staying there all alone for a long time, they become dissatisfied and anxious,

dn24:2.16.2 “Oh, if only other beings would come to this place.”

dn24:2.16.3 Then other sentient beings—due to the running out of their life-span or merit—pass away from that host of luminous deities and are reborn in that mansion of divinity in company with that being.

dn24:2.16.4 There they too are mind-made, feeding on rapture, self-radiant, wandering in midair, steadily glorious, and they remain like that for a very long time.

dn24:2.17.1 Now, the being who was reborn there first thinks,

dn24:2.17.2 “I am the Divinity, the Great Divinity, the Vanquisher, the Unvanquished, the Universal Seer, the Wielder of Power, God Almighty, the Maker, the Creator, the First, the Begetter, the Controller, the Father of those who have been born and those yet to be born. And these beings were created by me.

dn24:2.17.3 Why is that?

dn24:2.17.4 Because first I thought,

dn24:2.17.5 ‘Oh, if only other beings would come to this place.’

dn24:2.17.6 Such was my heart’s wish, and then these creatures came to this place.”

dn24:2.17.7 And the beings who were reborn there later also think,

dn24:2.17.8 “This must be the Divinity, the Great Divinity, the Vanquisher, the Unvanquished, the Universal Seer, the Wielder of Power, God Almighty, the Maker, the Creator, the First, the Begetter, the Controller, the Father of those who have been born and those yet to be born.

dn24:2.17.9 And we were created by him.

dn24:2.17.10 Why is that?

dn24:2.17.11 Because we see that he was reborn here first, and we arrived later.”

dn24:2.17.12 And the being who was reborn first is more long-lived, beautiful, and illustrious than those who arrived later.

dn24:2.17.14 It’s possible that one of those beings passes away from that host and is reborn in this place.

dn24:2.17.15 Having done so, they go forth from the lay life to homelessness.

dn24:2.17.16 By dint of keen, resolute, committed, and diligent effort, and right application of mind, they experience an immersion of the heart of such a kind that they recollect that past life, but no further.

dn24:2.17.17 They say:

dn24:2.17.18 “He who is the Divinity—the Great Divinity, the Vanquisher, the Unvanquished, the Universal Seer, the Wielder of Power, God Almighty, the Maker, the Creator, the First, the Begetter, the Controller, the Father of those who have been born and those yet to be born—by he we were created. He is permanent, everlasting, eternal, imperishable, remaining the same for all eternity.

dn24:2.17.19 We who were created by that divinity are impermanent, not lasting, short-lived, liable to pass away, and have come to this place.”

dn24:2.17.20 Is this how you describe in your denomination that the origin of the world came about as created by the God Almighty, by the Divinity?’

dn24:2.17.21 They say,

dn24:2.17.22 ‘That is what we have heard, Reverend Gotama, just as you say.’

dn24:2.17.23 Bhaggava, I understand the origin of the world.

dn24:2.17.24 I understand this, and what goes beyond it. Yet since I do not misapprehend that understanding, I have realized quenching within myself. Directly knowing this, the Realized One does not come to ruin.

dn24:2.18.1 There are some ascetics and brahmins who describe the origin of the world in their denomination as due to those depraved by play.

dn24:2.18.2 I go up to them and say,

dn24:2.18.3 ‘Is it really true that this is the venerables’ view?’

dn24:2.18.4 And they answer, ‘Yes’.

dn24:2.18.5 I say to them,

dn24:2.18.6 ‘But how do you describe in your denomination that the origin of the world came about due to those depraved by play?’

dn24:2.18.7 But they are stumped by my question, and they even question me in return.

dn24:2.18.8 So I answer them,

dn24:2.18.9 ‘Reverends, there are gods named “depraved by play”. They spend too much time laughing, playing, and making merry. And in doing so, they lose their mindfulness, and they pass away from that host of gods.

dn24:2.18.10 It’s possible that one of those beings passes away from that host and is reborn in this place.

dn24:2.18.11 Having done so, they go forth from the lay life to homelessness.

dn24:2.18.12 By dint of keen, resolute, committed, and diligent effort, and right application of mind, they experience an immersion of the heart of such a kind that they recollect that past life, but no further.

dn24:2.18.13 They say,

dn24:2.18.14 “The gods not depraved by play don’t spend too much time laughing, playing, and making merry. So they don’t lose their mindfulness, and don’t pass away from that host of gods.

dn24:2.18.15 They are permanent, everlasting, eternal, imperishable, remaining the same for all eternity.

dn24:2.18.16 But we who were depraved by play spent too much time laughing, playing, and making merry. In doing so, we lost our mindfulness, and passed away from that host of gods.

dn24:2.18.17 We are impermanent, not lasting, short-lived, liable to pass away, and have come to this place.”

dn24:2.18.18 Is this how you describe in your denomination that the origin of the world came about due to those depraved by play?’

dn24:2.18.19 They say,

dn24:2.18.20 ‘That is what we have heard, Reverend Gotama, just as you say.’

dn24:2.18.21 Bhaggava, I understand the origin of the world.

dn24:2.18.22 Directly knowing this, the Realized One does not come to ruin.

dn24:2.19.1 There are some ascetics and brahmins who describe the origin of the world in their denomination as due to those who are malevolent.

dn24:2.19.2 I go up to them and say,

dn24:2.19.3 ‘Is it really true that this is the venerables’ view?’

dn24:2.19.4 And they answer, ‘Yes’.

dn24:2.19.5 I say to them,

dn24:2.19.6 ‘But how do you describe in your denomination that the origin of the world came about due to those who are malevolent?’

dn24:2.19.7 But they are stumped by my question, and they even question me in return.

dn24:2.19.8 So I answer them,

dn24:2.19.9 ‘Reverends, there are gods named “malevolent”. They spend too much time gazing at each other, so they grow angry with each other, and their bodies and minds get tired. They pass away from that host of gods.

dn24:2.19.10 It’s possible that one of those beings passes away from that host and is reborn in this place.

dn24:2.19.11 Having done so, they go forth from the lay life to homelessness.

dn24:2.19.12 By dint of keen, resolute, committed, and diligent effort, and right application of mind, they experience an immersion of the heart of such a kind that they recollect that past life, but no further.

dn24:2.19.13 They say,

dn24:2.19.14 “The gods who are not malevolent don’t spend too much time gazing at each other, so they don’t grow angry with each other, their bodies and minds don’t get tired, and they don’t pass away from that host of gods.

dn24:2.19.15 They are permanent, everlasting, eternal, imperishable, remaining the same for all eternity.

dn24:2.19.16 But we who were malevolent spent too much time gazing at each other, so our minds grew angry with each other, our bodies and minds got tired, and we passed away from that host of gods.

dn24:2.19.17 We are impermanent, not lasting, short-lived, liable to pass away, and have come to this place.”

dn24:2.19.18 Is this how you describe in your denomination that the origin of the world came about due to those who are malevolent?’

dn24:2.19.19 They say,

dn24:2.19.20 ‘That is what we have heard, Reverend Gotama, just as you say.’

dn24:2.19.21 Bhaggava, I understand the origin of the world.

dn24:2.19.22 Directly knowing this, the Realized One does not come to ruin.

dn24:2.20.1 There are some ascetics and brahmins who describe the origin of the world in their denomination as having arisen as an anomaly.

dn24:2.20.2 I go up to them and say,

dn24:2.20.3 ‘Is it really true that this is the venerables’ view?’

dn24:2.20.4 And they answer, ‘Yes’.

dn24:2.20.5 I say to them,

dn24:2.20.6 ‘But how do you describe in your denomination that the origin of the world came about anomalously?’

dn24:2.20.7 But they are stumped by my question, and they even question me in return.

dn24:2.20.8 So I answer them,

dn24:2.20.9 ‘Reverends, there are gods named “non-percipient beings”.

dn24:2.20.10 When perception arises they pass away from that host of gods.

dn24:2.20.11 It’s possible that one of those beings passes away from that host and is reborn in this place.

dn24:2.20.12 Having done so, they go forth from the lay life to homelessness.

dn24:2.20.13 By dint of keen, resolute, committed, and diligent effort, and right application of mind, they experience an immersion of the heart of such a kind that they recollect the arising of perception, but no further.

dn24:2.20.14 They say,

dn24:2.20.15 “The self and the cosmos arose anomalously.

dn24:2.20.16 Why is that?

dn24:2.20.17 Because formerly I didn’t exist, whereas now, having not existed, I’ve transformed into the state of existing.”

dn24:2.20.18 Is this how you describe in your denomination that the origin of the world came about anomalously?’

dn24:2.20.19 They say,

dn24:2.20.20 ‘That is what we have heard, Reverend Gotama, just as you say.’

dn24:2.20.21 I understand this, and what goes beyond it. Yet since I do not misapprehend that understanding, I have realized quenching within myself. Directly knowing this, the Realized One does not come to ruin.

dn24:2.21.1 Though I state and assert this, certain ascetics and brahmins misrepresent me with the incorrect, hollow, false, untruthful claim:

dn24:2.21.2 ‘The ascetic Gotama has a distorted perspective, and so have his monks.

dn24:2.21.3 He says,

dn24:2.21.4 “When one enters and remains in the liberation of the beautiful, at that time one only perceives what is ugly.”’

dn24:2.21.5 But I don’t say that.

dn24:2.21.7 I say this:

dn24:2.21.8 ‘When one enters and remains in the liberation of the beautiful, at that time one only perceives what is beautiful.’”

dn24:2.21.9 “They are the ones with a distorted perspective, sir, who regard the Buddha and the mendicants in this way.

dn24:2.21.10 Sir, I am quite confident that the Buddha is capable of teaching me so that I can enter and remain in the liberation on the beautiful.”

dn24:2.21.11 “It’s hard for you to enter and remain in the liberation on the beautiful, since you have a different view, creed, and belief, and another discipline and denomination.

dn24:2.21.12 Come on, Bhaggava, carefully preserve the confidence that you have in me.”

dn24:2.21.13 “If it’s hard for me to enter and remain in the liberation on the beautiful, since I have a different view, creed, and belief, and another discipline and denomination.

dn24:2.21.14 I shall carefully preserve the confidence that I have in the Buddha.”

dn24:2.21.15 That is what the Buddha said.

dn24:2.21.16 Satisfied, the wanderer of the Bhaggava clan approved what the Buddha said.